WWJJD: What Will Jagr Do?

Will Jaromir Jagr be back in New York next season? That is the first question that must be answered before the Rangers can begin to conceive a plan for building their 2008-09 roster -- if Jagr comes back, that plan will center upon him, maybe not as much as in the past, but still... But if he decides to play elsewhere, the Rangers will need to consider Plan B -- acquiring another player as their centerpiece -- or even Plan C -- that's the one where fans have to be patient through a losing season while we wait for homegrown centerpieces to arrive and develop. Whatever plan they choose, let's just hope we don't end up with Plan 9 From Outer Space.

But back to Jagr. We know he had his worst season statistically since his sophomore season as Mario Lemieux's protege. We know he could have personally done more -- especially on the power play -- to score the 13 additional points he needed to automatically extend his $8.36 million a year contract. But what matters is not what we know, it's what he knows. Jagr knows he cannot get that much money next year, not from any team in creation, not at his age after the season he just had, though the way he finished the regular season and performed in the playoffs demonstrated that he's not finished as a team-carrier.

Presumably, the Rangers will be willing to pay him the $4.94 million they would have been thrilled to pay him yet again had his contract extension kicked in. They may even be willing to pay him more than that, especially since they know that at his age they can fashion a contract that can defer easily achievable bonuses into the following year's cap calculation. But will that be enough to keep him here, or will another team break the bank for him? If Michael Nylander commanded $4.875 for four years as Jagr's sidekick, how much will Jagr himself command with the cap bumped up to $55 million? If Brendan Shanahan was worth $5.3, how can one expect Jagr to settle for anything less than, say, $6 million -- or more?

But it's more than just money for Jagr. All other things being equal (i.e. the money), will Jagr choose to come back and play Tom Renney's defensive scheme and Perry Pearn's power play for another year? From his point of view (though some fans may think differently), sacrificing his numbers -- and his automatic contract extension -- to play dump and chase and to play defense and to mentor a rookie center was something Jagr was obviously willing to do this past season (he no doubt thought he could hit his target anyway), but it would be hard to imagine him being willing to do it again next season, especially if he doesn't get a long term contract.

Would Renney be flexible enough to alter his game plan for Jagr if Jagr demanded it? That would no doubt mean giving him more power play time, which he kind of complained about this season -- his time went down from 1:10 per power play in his first two full seasons as a Ranger to 55 seconds per power play this season. It would also no doubt mean letting Jagr resume control the of power play the way he likes to control it. Would that even be a good thing for the team overall, given the tepid power play results over the past two season? And to allow a player to dictate his preferences, if such was the case?

Finally, there is the issue of the dwindling Czech contingent on the team. One would be shocked if Martin Straka did not hang them up after the season he had -- one may be even more shocked if the Rangers bring him back for another season after the season he had, which could only be as a concession to Jagr should he re-sign. Marek Malik is gone for sure. Petr Prucha might as well be gone, having fallen off the depth chart -- he'd be worth more to the Rangers now as trade bait than anything else.

That leaves Michal Rozsival, who had a poor playoff showing against Pittsburgh -- it makes no sense to re-sign Rozsival, not at the price he will probably command, if Jagr is not around, since his success is tied to Jagr's presence. Conversely, if the Rangers value Rozsival that much, they have to consider that he is as likely to sign elsewhere if Jagr leaves as he is to re-sign here. Some may consider that a good thing, but replacing Rozsival will be no easy feat under the salary cap.

Finally, there is Jagr's public presence. Jagr knows that the media goes to Brendan Shanahan, Scott Gomez, Chris Drury, Henrik Lundqvist, and even Brandon Dubinsky and Dan Girardi for the easy interviews, and that they come to him only to ask the tough questions on the tough nights. He never shied away from that, but the strain was evident for all to see. That could weigh into his decision. He has often said that he loves playing in New York and that it is his top choice in the NHL, but the pressures of playing in New York may very well have gotten to him over this three-plus seasons here.

And no pressure is greater than that of a fan base that is very demanding. Jagr knows that his name was not chanted by the Garden crowd until Game 4 of the playoffs while others were lauded all season long -- and he knows he got a smattering of boos too when the team was at its lowest point. It cannot be lost on him that some still refuse to accept him as team captain, and he wouldn't be certifiable to wonder if his nationality figured into some of these equations. He is not so vain as to not realize that that was a reflection of his scoring slumps this season. But he may just decide that if he has worn out his welcome, there will be a line of other teams ready to snap him up.

When I add it all up, I don't see Jagr returning next season. He'll get his money somewhere, and he'll get it with assurances that he will get prime playing time in the kind of system he enjoys, and he may even get it with a team that will be closer to a Stanley Cup than the Rangers will probably be next season as they slide back necessarily into at least partial rebuilding mode. He said a while back that he knew what he wanted to do next season but he wouldn't tell -- if that decision was to return to New York, there was no reason not to tell (unless it was a return conditional on style of play and ice time).

Personally, I hope I'm wrong, because I love what Jagr has brought to the Rangers, on and off the ice, both as a fan and as someone who covers the team. And I can't see the Rangers replacing him without spending too many cap dollars, cap dollars already heavily committed to Gomez, Drury, and Lundqvist. He is the best option for New York for at least the next season or two. But is New York the best option for Jagr? I don't see how it can look that way to him at this point.

Sean Avery spoke to Larry Brooks of the New York Post by phone and reported that he is nearly back to full health, was injured when he tried to hit Brooks Orpik early in Game 3, and wants to return to the Rangers next season. Elsewhere, the local papers and whatnot have begun taking stock of the Rangers while still looking back a bit at the playoffs and season -- see the Daily News, Journal News, Newsday, Times, Record here and here, Blueshirts Blog, Blue Notes, Prospect Park, Stan Fischler at Game On!, Spector at FoxSports, and NY Sports Day. Oh, and did we mention how bad the officiating was?

Comments

[Marty]

Jagr will get a lucrative offer from one of several teams. A more offense orientated team would benefit him greatly. I would love to see him back on a 2 year deal at most but someone will overpay for him and do it for a lengthy period of time.

The way I see it:

He gets a deal done before the July 1st or he is not a Ranger.

Either way LGR!!!

[NYRFAN9]

Nice blog...but I have to disagree with something. You cannot write off Prucha just yet - I know that he had a terrible year, but his rookie year he scored most of his goals on PP. He needs t obe back on the PP, especially cause he will drive to the net. he is fast, he is young and he WILL rebound.
As far as Jagr, I too hope he returns because even at 1 point per game (which is low for him) he is a force and takes away other team's best D-men. But we all have to be patient. Rangers are moving in the right direction, we just have to stay positive!

[paularensburg]

rb94

Saw an awful lot of 1-2-2, which I think is the trap. As for Hank's Vezina noms, whatever? A losing season to me isn't made less disappointing by individual honors.

[paularensburg]

From Dellapina:

"The Pens’ D-men were just as panicky under pressure and routinely rimmed the puck up the boards in the hope that their forwards would win it back.

"That worked back in the Lemieux-Jagr days and it works again now for a very simple reason: opposing forwards and defensemen back off when those types of forwards fly their defending zone (as Malkin, Sidney Crosby and Hossa so often do). Makes you wonder whether, rather than expending so much energy coming all the way back only to get pinned along the right half-boards so many times, Jagr might have been better off doing what he insists all the top scorers in the league do: cherry picking.

"Just asking."

http://www.nydailynews.com/blogs/rangers/2008/05/what-went-wrong-in-game-5.html#comments

Don't think I've read a better argument against Renney's system.

[cwgatti]

Jagr is the Rangers Achilles heel. The Rangers need to break away from him and his aura at some point, but with the pieces they have now, that doesn't look too promising. I would accept a one or two year deal now, with the emphasis on developing defense (which except for Stall is below average at best).

And another thing, Jagr is still a dominant player. But there is no question that he is treated with bias by the refs. Jagr gets fouled on every shift. How he doesn't draw more penalties is just a travesty.

And as far as Prucha goes, I believe he is finally succumbing to the brutal hits he has been taking the last three years. . . . .He may have played his last game at MSG.

[Joe]

I've seen enough during the Pen series to cancel my Center Ice package for next season. If the inept officiating is the best the league could produce, I'd rather watch reruns of Hanna Montana with my daughter rather than suffer through Bettman's vision of fair gamesmanship.

[pj]

Jess, You are the one who doesn't get it. Saying "wake up" to people is not demeaning in anyway shape or form.

Your projection is pathologic.

Whenever anyone dared to criticize the rangers, you would jupmp down their throats. Yet, you tell me that everyone is entitled to their opinion!

And you make assumptions about the type of fan I am. You have no idea what my Ranger Fandom encompasses. You have no idea if I postponed my honeymoon due to the Rangers being in the playoffs.

So don't make any assumptions about me.

You picked the Rangers to win this series going away! Those who didn't agree with you were dismissed and criticized. Who was right and who was wrong? With all your great insight into the rangers (being a professional "journalist" and all) those who were not wearing their fan blinders turned out to be correct.

It is interesting how Lynn Zinser ( a REAL journalist mind you) in todays NY Times expresses the SAME OPINION I HAD that led me to write "wake up" in my post:

"If the Rangers keep him from returning to Pittsburgh, they would take a chunk out of the lineup of a division rival, one that looks as if it will be formidable for years to come."

Thanks Lynn! It sure is nice to be validated by a real journalist.

[TonyM]

Bob McKenzie on NHL Live yesterday said that JJ may very well return to NY , as he likes the City and he likes playing for Renney.JJ wants to be with a coach he likes. So I think if JJ and Slats agree on a price he will come back to the Rangers.
But he is an enigmatic, finicky player and he may just want to get away from the NHL and play a less demanding shchedule with OMSK.

Ron Duguay when asked what the Rangers need to get to the next level said" The Rangers need more grit and toughness, especially on the back line"
Renney said that going forward the Rangers needed to improve in the " physical engagement" of the game.
The sad thing is we have been saying it as fans for over a decade. So what did Sather do in the face of this need? He traded for Backman at the dealine, clearly a move that did not help for the playoff run.
This could be a fun summer as Sather retools the team that has some very good parts to it i.e.a franchise goalie. but if he retools the way he did after the lock out ( lots of soft Euro types and undersized wings) than we are all going to be very disappointed,

[David]

Its purely speculation but if Jagr re-signs and we could add Hossa in place of straka (while weakening Pitts) that is a pretty good 1st line.

[out0fyourelement]

http://msn.foxsports.com/nhl/boxscore?gameId=2005111615

from my research, this is the first occurrence of the "Sidney Crosby Hat Trick"

Goal, Assist, Unsportsmanlike Conduct Penalty

[Bob Merchant]

All I know is that this team was designed to win this year with JJ, Gomer, Hank, Drury and Shanny. It obviously did not pan out.

I guess only JJ will know or already knows what will happen but this team without 68 leaves a void that will not be filled from the ranks.

Even if JJ was not scoring, the other team was so preoccupied with him, it left holes for guys like Dubi as JJ was double covered.

Who will be our "go to guy"? Where is our Ilya Kovalchuk, Evgeni Malkin, Marian Gaborik or Vincent Lecavalier?

Oh by the way, check the leading scorers on NHL.com. Jagr is still showing top dog at 15 points through the 2 rounds. Amazing eh?

Can we really wait for our miracle kid to get out of Russia, play with the Pack and then become our guy? By then, Gomer and Drury will probably be free agents. *sigh*

[Pavel]

Jagr should be allowed to take his sweet time. IMO, he should pull a Selanne.. get your money, but wait.

I'd like to see Slats go after Orpik, Redden, and Hossa, but Marian will be pricy!

[ivrfydov]

Not a rich UFA list this year. The Rangers could do worse than Michael Ryder on RW.

For those who are interested in Elisha, she's now hanging out with Dion Phaneuf.

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/showbiz/bizarre/article1130475.ece

[laurie]

A very well reasoned piece. Yet my instincts tell me that -- despite all those good reasons not to -- he'll be back. I don't expect the decision to be made early, though, and would not be surprised to see July 1st come and go without word on his future plans. One thing I do know is that the deciding factor will not be the money, unless of course Slats offers so little (i.e. less than Shanny got this year) as to completely offend him. And despite all the talk out of Russia, I don't for a minute believe he will play for Omsk next season. He's not done in the NHL, and he proved that to himself and everyone else this spring. I do think what Slats does on July 1st could be the deciding factor. The system Renney plays is due in large part to the pieces with which he has to work. And in this case, the pieces on defense required a strong defensive effort on the part of the forwards. Upgrade the defense and you allow for a little more freedom up front.

[Alan]

and there's also the scheduled trip to prague for the beginning of next season to consider. would the jagr/rozey/straka-less rangers really be the team to invite? i hope i'm wrong, because i want those three gone, but i wonder if that was a sign of things to come.

[kovazub94]

I think Jagr will come back. I won't be surprised if he's signed to 3 more years. It probably will be in $6.5 to $7 mil range. Our forward unit will be easier to replace or even upgrade (over departing Shanny & Straka) just by continued development of players that are going to stay + new promotions from AHL + UFA (just one please).
I TOTALLY disagree with Dubi re. Prucha. He has the LEAST value as the trade bait in his 3 years with the Rangers, but if he stays he could provide valuable depth on any 4 lines next season in case of injuries (and also hopefully a chance to bounce back to his old form).
My biggest concern is on the defense. I doubt Rangers are going to bring up more than one true rookie. That means that it's going to be very difficult and expensive to get upgrade on D that includes a true # 1 defenseman (and get them all to play well as a unit). Currently we have three players that we know of definitely - Tyutin, Girardi & Staal. Rosival and Mara will ask for two much $$ (especially Rosival). Malik, Backman & Strudwick are just not good enough. Who can replace them (4 positions)? Hatchinson is not a rookie and after a good season in AHL he might be up to play 6 or 7. Sanguinetti is the first in line of true rookies to also get a shot because of his offensive potential. He should be slotted to be 5 or 6. Mara can be brought back if he's willing to play for less. Or either Pock, Baranka or Potter could get a chance too. But Rangers are lacking a true # 1 defenseman and IMHO it's the most glaring Rangers need for this offseason ir-regardless of anything else.

[Jess]

PJ

With all your great insight into the rangers (being a professional "journalist" and all) those who were not wearing their fan blinders turned out to be correct.

Uh PJ you keep harping on my being a professional journalist when I am the first to admit that I am not. Is that some kind of sexual obsession for you?

You also ignore the other criticisms I have of you about your trashing people for not having a detached or realistic view of the Rangers.

That makes you again a pompous self-righteous clown, again who are you to decide the standards for this blog?

Answer a nobody and that you are unwilling to allow anyone to be a cheerleader fan speaks volumes about yourself. None of which are nice.

I am not the one who brought up being a season ticket holder or length of service as some way to validate your status as a Ranger fan. That was you.

Oh wow you use the New York Times of all places with their part time Ranger coverage to think it makes your point special. Try using someone who provided full time coverage of the Rangers.

I do not need such validation, I predicted that the Rangers would win in 5 and was wrong oh well pooh pooh happens.

Seeing being wrong is something I can live with it.

On the other hand it makes me wonder if you can't because you have been about the folks here.

Now WAKE UP yourself, I am not a trained professional journalist, I am a trained scout who is studying journalism.

Get it right already

When there are no prospects to evaluate I am allowed to return to being a fan (except it seems in your world). That call is not yours to make until the day you own this site.

Again you seem to have this obsession with what roles I play here so until I see your name on those checks I cash then yours is a view that has no value to me.

You are nothing more than a person trying to be a pompous donkey rear end and you do it quite well.

Lynn Zinger as a point of validation, wow that is almost as funny as saying Larry Brooks is a super special reporter.

You would have cited the National Star if it "validated" you.

[Paul R _ _ _ _ _ D]

---Now WAKE UP yourself, I am not a trained professional journalist, I am a trained scout who is studying journalism.---

Boy, girl, cub or brownie scout?

--You are nothing more than a person trying to be a pompous donkey rear end and you do it quite well.--

You just called him an ass' ass, now that says something!

[Paul R _ _ _ _ _ D]

with the exception of beligerant Pen's bandwagon fans we are all Ranger fans, why do people feel the need to put there team down? this is our team if you don't like it pick one of the other 29, instead of constantly berating the team coach and gm pick new clothes to root for becuase in essance thats all we are really voting for here the blueshirts the player are wearing at any given time. Instead of saying how much better you would be as coach just be thankful for the fact that the last three seasons we have had somethig to do in the spring other then watch basbeall, we are watching kids come into there own on our team, a lot of teams have gotten younger talent so have we, instead of bitching and moaning about what we don't have lets look at what we do, and whats in the pipeline. I picked the blueshirts to win in 6 I was wrong, but you'll never hear me say in the beggining of a series oh god we are going to lose, I don't think that way I felt since the first puck drop that we would go deeper, and now I look forward to next season where I will do it again. the off season could see players stay come and go, so again we have something to look forward to now. I am a ranger and i believe in this team, it was not to be this year, maybe next year.

[Jed Orts]

is it october yet??

Philly is going to go at Pitt really hard, every single game and I wonder if that will be what's needed to beat them.
I hope the Stars win and Joel lights up Biron in the finals.

[kovazub94]

Even though it was a pretty bitter series, I can't bring myself to root for Phily. If the SC final is Pens vs. Detroit/Dallas, I'm going to be happy from the entertainment standpoint.

[And This One Will Last A Lifetime]

I agree taht raising the talent level of D should help alleviate some of the defensive responsibilities for the forwards. As great as it is to see Gomez generate rushes from our end, he rarely had the support coming down the ice to truly make the most of penetrating the attack zone. Often times you could see the opposing team form a box around him and let him veer off to the boards where rarely it turned into any sort of threat. I have no idea who will be used to fill out the half of our D that isn't committed to next year (Staal, Girardi, Tyutin...Backman needs to earn his spot and should thus be designated as a 7th D). Maybe Drury can at least get Campbell interested in coming here but from what I saw of him in the playoffs he's prone to overplaying the puck near the blueline. Also, San Jose looks to have plenty of cap room to give him the $6 million he'll probably command.

The size issue will need to be addressed, although I don't think it would hurt to let Sjostrom play 3rd line minutes next year. True, he won't be mistaken for a former Legion of Doom winger but he plays well on the boards and doesn't have the stonehands like his predecessor Marcel Hossa.

As far as Jagr goes, in a perfect world they'd open up the playing style (not just for him) and he'd register around 30 goals and 80 points. They'd also be able to see what they've got in the youngsters without being overly reliant on their production. Don't get me wrong, I loved watching Dubi, Cally and Dawes progress this year but let's see them take that next step. That means around a 20G/30A season for Dubi, 12-15G from Cally and at least 15G from Dawes before thinking our franchise is set for next year and beyond.

We might not have the top end young talent of Pittsburgh but there's no guarantee that they'll be able to keep their team intact. I've said before that they'll be unable to keep both Hossa and Malone, unless Malone gives them a tremendous hometown discount. Malkin won't be an RFA until after next year but the Pens would be stupid to not buy out some of his restricted free agency since they'll be more than just Kevin Lowe willing to throw a individual cap limit offer sheet to him. Fleury will also get a pay raise as well.

As for the rest of our division, the Flyers have more questions marks than their current run suggests. Who knows whether Simon Gagne will come back as an effective player if he comes back at all. They've got some fossils or guys entering the backside of their career on defense as well.

The Islanders are probably going to go with a glorified AHL team next year and the Devils aren't quite as far under the cap that miserly LouLam likes to project.

The Caps are on the rise and maybe Carolina gets their act together, but I don't see anything to worry about with the Florida teams and it very well looks like Atlanta is on the path to losing their second NHL franchise.

The Habs should be the front runner of the NE although how much of their success this year was underpinned by Kovalev having a good year? What happens if he goes back to having a trademarked frustrating year? The Bruins could have something to build on, the Senators will most likely be gutted, the Sabres could put a respectable team on the ice but who knows if Miller's impending contract situation will throw the team in disarray. Then there's Toronto, it can't be so bad if people aren't waiving their NTC's.

[njaco1215]

well now theres too long to wait for next season. im glad we didnt get swept by pitt.seeing the young guys step up this year was great so i'll deff be getting center ice again next year.Now i just wish i got a pic of b.dubi signing my jersey last year down here w/ the pack.
as for next year i dont see pru going somewhere w/ the possibility of atleast 4 wingers leaving(JJ,Straka,Avery,Shanny)unless he's packaged in a deal for a better pick or other trade. bring on next oct, i cant wait to see what the youth brings next year.

[Chris QCT]

Jed Orts - I think you're exactly right. I think Philly is going to get in their faces and slam them around. The NYR had better games when they stopped sitting back and decided to take away time and space. Philly is not going to take their crap. They're not going to play this passive, turn-the-other-cheek, sissy trap hockey that Tom Renney demands.

We had what was considered a soft 'European' team 3 seasons ago. Sather made the moves to bring in more North American players. But now we're just a soft team overall.

[Dubi]

Jess, PJ -- Please, calm down, guys.

PJ, no one needs a wake up call to realize how good the Pens are, we just saw them beat us in five games. But since you need a "real" journalist to tell you what's really going on, how about JD at the DN: "It will be quite another [thing] for Shero to keep even a Sidney Crosby-centered team at or near the top with almost every other important skater in the Penguins' lineup either entering unrestricted free agency this July (Hossa, Ryan Malone, Brooks Orpik) while Evgeni Malkin enters the final year of his entry-level deal."

And PJ -- It is not "cheerleading" to believe that the Rangers could have won this series -- even Crosby said so. And it is not "cheerleading" to be optimistic about the future even if Pittsburgh seems to be developing into a potential powerhouse. Your entitled to your opinion, but it is in fact demeaning to other people to label their opinion as "cheerleading" when it is, in many cases, just a contrary opinion to yours.

[Nickyboy44]

Dont fear Rnager fans...Jagr will be back. However the rest of the Czech contingent needs to go. They can find a cheap countrymate somewhere. The Rangers need to become more physical. It killed them in the series (outhit 36-17 ib final game). I have never been a Jagr fan but he was spectacular in the playoffs, and from all acounts he is well respected in the locker room. The guy deserves another contract. As far as the rest of the Czechs (Rosival, Malik, Straka)...goodbye! It's time to match size with size. The fans of the Prucha's and Dawe's of the NHL need simply to look at the two teams that are going to the conference finals. Both Pitt and Philly agre huge and physical up front. Something the Rangers are definitely lacking,

[Bones]

Getting to the next level, has nothing to do with whether JJ returns, its all about overhauling our stereotyped and unoriginal coaching staff. I'll say it again---Renney is just like Roger Neilson and he'll never ever take a team to the Cup and I'll bet on it, just like I bet that Mottau would eventually play in the NHL. But folks, believe it or not, Slats is actually clueless as a GM. He's only as good as whoever he designates to actually figure things out, like Muckler or Maloney. What would get ME excited would be to see MM behind that bench coaching Dubinsky, Callahan, Dawes, Staal etc. Winners breed winners, nothing complicated about it. The talent was there to get the job done, but the leadership wasn't there to make it happen.

[Dubi]

Deadly -- You're right that the team didn't intentionally tank to get their recent high draft picks -- the intentional tanking was in Mario Lemieux's draft year. You remember that one, right? That was the one that forced the NHL to change its draft rules and institute a lottery so that no one would tank again.

Actually, it was Penguins fans tanking in recent years that got those draft picks used on Malkin, Fleury, and Staal (Crosby was a gift from the NHL). Maybe you don't understand the economics of any business -- no customers, no profits and the first thing you do is lay off workers. The disappearance of fair-weather Penguin fans as soon as the team ran into hard times caused them to have to sell off their players, not vice versa.

For Pittsburgh fans to be rewarded for their lack of faith in their team with the high draft picks that helped build their current team is sick.

[Paul R _ _ _ _ _ D]

--What would get ME excited would be to see MM behind that bench coaching Dubinsky, Callahan, Dawes, Staal etc.--

Who is MM? the only person I can think of with those initials does not deserve to be in a hockey broadcasting booth.

[paulinflorida]

Thanks Dubi, some good insight on Jagr's situation. I also don't think he will be back next season and based on his regular season performance (playing not to get the automatic extension)he made that decision months ago. I have said that in previous posts and my original thinking was that he may be done with playing in the NHL. After reading your article and a little after thought he may still want to play in the NHL but with another team. I don't see Renney altering the style of play for the entire team in order to let jagr do his thing and open up his game. I also believe that his awesome playoff performance was to prove to everyone that he can still be a dominant player either in the NHL or any other place on this planet. Not having him next year leaves a big hole in next years version, one not easily filled for sure. Also agree that it is time for Straka and Prucha to move on. The defense is another story....I am sure you can write a whole article on that subject and what needs to be done there..........

[ntb]

Dubi, I am unfamiliar with the Crosby as an NHL gift to the Penguins storyline. What exactly happened? How did (could?) the NHL ensure Crosby would go to the Pens with the lottery system?

[Paul R _ _ _ _ _ D]

short version, bettmen in all his high and mighty god like power decided instead of having crosby go with the first pick "all" teams would have a shot and magically pitts came out on top.

[oleosmirf]

dubi

unfortunately i have to agree with you. Renney's system isn't good for Jagr and his teammates, aside from Dubinsky, just werent able to play up to his level.

I stated before the season that the Gomez signing could wind up to be the worst move in Rangers history and while that seems a bit extreme this is what I was afraid of.

I was afraid the Rangers would build a team around Scott Gomez and have our franchise player putting up 16 goals and 50 assists a season. Don't get me wrong Gomez is a very good player but he's not good enough to build a Stanley Cup team around.

To win a Stanley Cup, you need to build a team around a star player, someone like Iginla, Lecavalier, Crosby, Ovechkin Lidstrom, E. Staal etc.

Unfortunatly we dont have that type of player in NY or in the system (Jess might beg to differ though). Jagr is the best option at this point in time. The UFAs this season are very weak and letting Jagr go and overpaying for guys like Huselius, Malone or Vrbata is a terrible way to go.

Keep Jagr and appease him with resigning Straka as well and then when a guy like Kovalchuk hits the market in 09-10 then let Jagr and Straka go and pay Kovalchuk who i'm sure would love to play on a line with Anisimov and Cherepanov.

I dont know who else is available in 09-10 but in a bad UFA year the Rangers cant fall into a trap of giving a guy like Malone 5 million for 5 years b/c he played with Crosby and Malkin and then when he goes to NY he plays with Dawes and Gomez and barely puts up 15 goals.

We have cap room go resign Jagr and Avery. If Straka wants to play keep him or take the money left over from his and Shanny's retirement and go after Prospal, a big czech winger who can finish. Package Prucha and a pick/prospect for a decent 2nd line RW. Replace Roszival with Hainsey and sign a guy like the older Sauer and someone else to sure up the blueline and if we need cap room dump Backman's 3.4 million for a 7th rounder. There has to be a team like Phoenix or Florida that would take him for nothing...

Prospal-Dubinsky-Jagr
Avery-Gomez-Somebody via trade
Dawes-Drury-Callahan
Korpikoski-Betts-Sjostrom

Scratched: Byers/Orr/Jessiman, Moore

Staal-Hainsey
Tyutin-Girardi
Baranka/Potter-K. Sauer

Stratched: a better version of Strudwick

Lundqivst
Valliquette

[Paul R _ _ _ _ _ D]

who woulda thunk 2 years later he would be playing captain, and all this good fortune comes as pitts had no superstars, so they got luckey

[deadlyd]

The team went bankrupt before they had to sell off the majority of their star players. It seems you have the order of the events mixed up. The team made the playoffs every year until they traded Jagr before the 2002 season, also due to their economic situation. They were pulling in 16,000-15,000 through the 2002 season before their first losing season. Of course Penguins fans, who along with the rest of America are suffering through an economic recession, aren't going to blindly support a team who is selling off all of its star players and finishing in last.

[deadlyd]

Paul, you do realize the Penguins came in last place the year before and thus, in a normal year, would have the best chance to pick first. Bettman giving all teams a chance was a gift to the REST of the NHL, NOT the Penguins.

[aneirin]

This is the dilemma for next year. The team without Jagr will not be as good because they'll find it very hard to make up those 70+ points that he'd contribute and would almost definitely become a team primarily dependant on it's goaltender and defense to get them into the post season. On the other hand, the team with Jagr absolutely cannot do any better than they did this year because in order to win in the post season, you need your power play working, 2 pp goals (not counting the empty netter) in 5 games is what cost the series nothing more nothing less and a Jagr centric power play is going keep going in the same direction we've seen over the last two years. Nowhere.

So what's your poison. Take the step back this year or wait another year or two before you still have to take that step back. Me, I'd just bite the bullet, get a workmanlike team who'll run an honest power play and trust the draft, our stable of prospects, and gaming the system to get the missing offensive and defensive pieces. We've got a very young core, we should show the patience we all said we'd have when we were clamoring for a rebuild.

[Bones]

Paul R--- no its not Mike Milbury I refer to, I thought it would be obvious but apparently not----Mark Messier.

[NCSteve]

Thanks for a great year to everybody on this board. Thanks for the all the great games, insights, and laughs. Thanks for the Blueshirt Bulletin. And thanks to the Rangers for getting better and better. It'll be sad to see guys go (I hope Jagr and Shanny stay), but with developing players likely to be part of the mix, it will be interesting to see who arrives for the team in the fall.

I'm just sorry that I don't have any more Rangers games to watch for awhile. I figured the series would continue, maybe even go seven. THAT would've been some great hockey. Those were tough games to watch for a lot of different reasons, but all-in-all they were entertaining and exciting. Who could ask for more?

One last plug, Dubi: If you haven't subscribed to the Blueshirt Bulletin, wadda ya thinkin'? Do it today!

[oleosmirf]

if Jaromir Jagr is not a NY Ranger next season and a star player is not brought in to replace him then the NY Rangers will not make the playoffs next season...

[Paul R _ _ _ _ _ D]

ok so the diving birds know how to tank religiously, even though it s lottery and its not always the person with the worst record that picks first.

[Phill]

How about the Rangers 'pull a Penguins' and tank to draft Stamkos?

[Phill]

Whoops, I actually meant Tavares--- Stamkos is already a Bolt as far as I'm concerned.

[oleosmirf]

paul R_D

the Penguins sucked for a number of years and as a result they got Fleury after trading up from 3rd overall, Malkin 2nd overall and Crosby 1st overall.

They just got lucky and got 3 stud players at the top of the draft. How can you blame the NHL for that????

[Paul R _ _ _ _ _ D]

Sorry Phill cann't do that, never root for my team to lose

[Dubi]

Deadly -- The bankruptcy is not an excuse -- Pens' fans could have saved the team by sticking with them. The bankruptcy was the price for winning the Cups in the early 90s -- the deferred salaries came due. The Rangers likewise paid the price for their Cup win in terms of the pipeline of players having been bankrupted with guys like Tony Amonte, Doug Weight, and others traded for rentals needed to win that Cup.

But long after the bankruptcy was settled, all the Pens' players were still in place in 2001 and the team had been profitable in the two seasons leading up to that point (look it up if you don't beleive me). But the Pens traded Jagr, and then Lemieux and Straka got hurt, the Pens missed the playoffs, and bye-bye fair weather fans -- only then did the team start to lose money and lose all the other players and lose all its games.

[rs27]

I thought the D was much better with Strudwick in there. Maybe its because Hank was making the saves but there seemed to be a better sense of calm. Somehow the Rangers need to get a puck moving defenseman, a big winger, and a big defenseman this offseason to contend for the Cup, I just don't see those 3 things out there at once.

I think the major hope is Staal grows into a qb on the powerplay and try to pick up the other two pieces elsewhere.

[And This One Will Last A Lifetime]

Mark Messier will not be coach of the Rangers any time soon. Successful playing career does not always equate to successful coach, just ask Gretzky. Could he become a successful coach, maybe. But for every Larry Robinson you have a Trottier. And the most successful coach in NHL history never made it beyond the minors.

[deadlyd]

Baldwin made many bad decisions, no doubt about it. However, the bankruptcy is an excuse when the bankruptcy court ruled they could not have a payroll above $32 million. They economics of hockey made it impossible to compete with teams with large revenues in big markets like the Rangers, Flyers, etc.

The Penguins players were still in place in 2001, but they year after came many hard decisions in regards to signing players. The Jagr trade was inevitable, as was the trade/inability to resign the other players. The Penguins couldnt afford it. Patrick made horrible 1st round picks for years leading up to this as well.

But you're right. The Pens inability to afford talent, along with Patrick's inability to be a somewhat decent GM had nothing to do with the Penguins tanking. It was all Craig Patrick's plan to tank and lose his job to save the Penguins in Pittsburgh.

[paulf]

I don't think any team that had one of the top 3 picks the prior year should have been allowed to get the no. 1 overall in the Crosby draft. The Pens got a No. 2 for being bad in 03-04 and a No. 1 overall the next year even though no season had been played. I do NOT think the NHL weighted the lottery to favor the Pens, but it is unfair to the rest of the league that they got Top 2 picks two years in a row for playing one lousy season.

That is neither here nor there anymore.

Bottom line is the Rangers didn't strengthen the team at the deadline because they wanted to keep kids. They still had a shot, they were the second-best team in the east, unfortunately they ran into the first in the second round.

With Lundqvist in goal, the Rangers will be competitive for years and we know they will spend up to the cap limit to field a talented team. There is no one formula for winning the cup. Teams with weak goalies and no offensive stars have won, it's just a matter of getting hot and playing the right teams. San Jose has a lot more to be surprised about right now than the Rangers.

Reading Stan Fischler's piece, he was hard on Prucha, blaming him for the OT goal that ended the season. I get the feeling that reflects management's view and he may be gone. With Dawes and Callahan, we have a quota of small wingers, and they are much stronger and tougher despite their size. Prucha gives effort, but he spends too much time on his butt.

[baals]

id like to see him back if our style opened up a bit. most of the fans i talk to agree that this year for the most part was difficult to watch, even when we won games. it wasnt until the last half when we needed to win games and every other game was against new jersey and philly and the isles that it was exciting.

i just hope we can rejuvenate our blueline next year with some more toughness and better puck movement. so many times in the pittsburg series our d-men shot themselves in the foot by not being decisive enough with the puck when they got it. that one split second gave the pens just enough time to close in and force our D to make another pass behind the net where another penguin forechecker would then pounce on whoever was recieving the pass just as quickly as the puck would get there. all of a sudden the pens fourth line is cycling in our zone and causing all kinds of havoc.

[rangerbill94]

bones

I thought you meant Merik Malik!!!

Dubi

I do not agree with your position on Rozi. He will be back, he is an asset. You claim his success is tied to Jagr. I think just the opposite. When he gets a PP opportunity he is always looking for a pass to JJ unless Jagr isn't on the ice. His shot is a good one from the point and he has shown he can score goals. I believe he would have had more PP points if he was never put on the ice with JJ! Also, the Rangers had no threat at all from the blueline when Rozi wasn't there. Yes, Girardi is coming on, but Mara, Tyutin, Backman, Strudwick and Malik were guys who simply held the puck in the zone, their offensive upside was offensive! Staal will develop into a solid D'man so no issue there. Therefore, Rozsival is the ONLY defenseman that really produced an offensive upside and in view of the need to get 2 more defensemen, I can't see the Rangers dumping Rozi and start looking for 3 good defenseman. We haven't had much success finding one...getting 3 will be a real trick.

[Phill]

Paul R___d

I wasn't suggesting we root for the Rangers to lose or tank this season. I can never do that, either.

However, and I don't know how you could say otherwise, but hypothetically, if the Rangers tanked the season (for whatever reason) and ended up with the number 1 overall, wouldn't you be ecstatic knowing that Tavares (assuming he continues to tear it up, without some kind of career ending injury) would be a Ranger?

I don't remember what position he plays, but just try and imagine a team with Dubinsky, Staal, Cherepanov, Sanguinetti, Anismov, and Tavares (and that's not including Lundqvist, Drury and Gomez).

Toews and Kane resurrected the Hawks this season. Imagine a player, whose arguably better than both of them, can do for the Rangers.

I'll end it with this. I would LOVE for the Rangers to win the cup next season, however low the probability of that occurring is. At the same time, you won't see me losing sleep if the Rangers draft Tavares.

[Phill]

Actually, I just remembered.... (so I wanna correct my previous post)

This is directed towards two seasons from now because from what I recall, Tavares isn't draft eligible until then anyways. I know he wanted to be eligible for the upcoming draft, but for whatever reason he can't be.... or something.

[stuart]

the rangers should keep prucha.. he will not fetch much in a trade and he can produce given some minutes with guys other then hollwegg types...

let prucha replace Shanny on his line and right there he will score 20+.. the rangers should definitely let; straka, shanny, malik, strudwick and roszi go. Roszi is a good player but he will be paid like agreat D man which he is not..

I like mara if he will accept 2 yrs for $2 mill. I think he is worth it!!!!!!!!!He is a good d man, he played well for the rangers especially down the stretch...

tyutin cannot be on the PP, his shot is a disaster..

If Jagr will accept 2 yrs at a about $5 I do it. if not, he can go. I will miss him and thank him for his service but they cannot build the team around him...Guys need to stop deferring to him and shoot the damn puck...

[Phill]

Wow, sorry---- a lack of sleep is clearly at work.

Assuming the Rangers tank next season and get the #1 pick, then they would be able to draft Tavares as he'd be eligible by then.

I keep mixing up and forgetting about this years draft.

[Matty *Happy Birthday to me*]

if Jaromir Jagr is not a NY Ranger next season and a star player is not brought in to replace him then the NY Rangers will not make the playoffs next season...

Well then Oleo, if Jagr isn't signed and a star player doesn't replace him then next season will be easy for you ... you won't have to watch the games and certainly not the playoffs as far as the Rangers are concerned since you already know what will happen ...

I, unlike you, am not psychic and disregardless of whether Jagr is back or not, of whether the team replaces him with another top player I will continue to believe in our team and cheer them on ... because if I ever felt that they were going to lose then I wouldn't bother watching, what for? You never know what is going to happen ... Nashville had a firesale and in the toughest conference in the League they made the top 8 and took Detroit to 6 games ... but to each it's own ...

I want Jagr back and I know he loves playing in New York City and being a Ranger ... however fun isn't exactly the word he would use to describe the system he has to play now but he does like and respect Renney so who knows ... We scored a lot in the season after the lockout and Renney's system then isn't dramatically different from what it is now and Jagr had his best season as a Ranger ... it's all about the talent that you have to compliment your other players to allow them room to be their creative selfs without sacrificing good defense ...

[ant]

Yes Jagr is my favorite player.Yes i would take him over anybody else in the NHL on my team (well mayve Ovechkin bout thats about it)BUT if he decides not to play for us WE ARE NOT DOOMED!!!Devils won cups with having Elias-Gomez-Gianta as their 1st line.That means Brodeur and D was the ones winning the cups for them.Now the point to all this is Sather need to focus on building solid D.Our offense is OK w/o jags and the rest.Would u rather waste 5 mills on malone and around 8 9 on Hossa or would u rather sign 2 Good Ds(even tho UFA market is weak theres a few i wouldnt mind seeing in the rangers blue.Like people savo Kovo will be ufa next season so is anpother bunch of players includin Malkin who pens might not be ablke to hold on to.Malkin might get greedy and leave pitts for more money or he just might get tired playing in shadow of Cindy!.

So chill people its not that bad the cup will come to us its time to rebuild the francise and so far sather and Renney been doing good job.We have a lot youth in a line up in their 1st full seasons and we have couple of more coming up.Dont forget Cherepanov and Anisimov are both coming to our team season after this so LETS GO RANGERS!!!!

[adam]

Rangerbill, how is Rosival an asset? The guy is mediocre in his own zone, has terrible giveaways far too often, and his offensive "prowess" came in a 2 week period, then he spent the rest of the season missing the net, when he even decided to shoot, which was never. I'd MUCH rather have a guy like Jason Smith than Rosival here. I want to see people in front of Hank punished, not left alone to screen him. Our d is soft, Rosival is part of the problem. I wrote in another post, we need a Philidelphia Flyers type renovation. We need more of a gritty, hardworking, workmanlike team. Guys like Straka (God awful btw, if we have to keep him to keep Jagr, let them both go) Shanny, Mara, Malik, Backman all need to go. We can replace these guys with youngsters or cheap free agents who bust their butt every shift..I'm tired of the inconsistent efforts night in and night out.

I'm with a lot of people here, I give credit to Renney for helping turn this team around, but enough is enough. This guy isn't good in game, you barely see him make a change when something doesnt work.. He played Hollweg all year when a guy like Korpikovski was probably ready (I'll even go as far to say, could he be worse than Hollweg?) Callahan and Dawes never got PP time while guys like Straka and Shanny ate up the important minutes. I know about stanley cup experience, but now, I'd rather have the younger guy with no experience who can score and get in front of the net than aging veterans who are slower and would rather pass than shoot. I dont know what coach would be a good fit, but someone that can open this thing up a bit and let guys like Gomez, Jagr (if hes back), Drury, Callahan and Dawes get big minutes and put up better than 30-60 point seasons.

[Ryan]

Personally I hope Jagr comes back, although I tend to believe that Dubi is probably right saying that he won't. Oleo was right that personnel wise, Jagr definitely gives us the best chance to win the Stanley Cup next year. He's still a fantastic player in this league and, if nothing else, he opens up opportunities for everyone else on the team. The other team is going to play their best defensive line and pair against Jagr. Similarly, when Jagr is on the ice, he's likely to be closely watched by two of the opposition players, which opens up room for the other people on his line. The only problem with this is that we don't have a quality player to put on the left side of a line with Jagr to keep the opposition honest. To be honest I thought Avery was the best choice there, but Renney obviously didn't think so. If Jagr does decide to leave, I wish the best of luck to the man. He was a fantastic servant for our team, and led us to the playoffs in three consecutive seasons (that first one was particularly memorable), and I truly believe that he was a fantastic captain. I don't blame him at all for leaving if he does, as playing this type of system really doesn't make that much sense at this point in his career (then again I don't think this system would ever truly fit Jagr's playing style - past or present..) Here's to hoping he returns though! I wonder who becomes captain if Jagr does leave...? I suppose the likely choice is Drury even though he's only been here for a year.

The only person that would really be better than Jagr in the free agent market is Hossa, and based on the fact that we have three players already signed to pretty monster contracts, he's not a viable option - as much as I wish he was one. Hossa is the player I think we lack at the moment and would turn us into a Stanley Cup contender overnight. He can do everything, but more importantly, can score goals in situations most of our players could only dream about... but he's just a bit of wishful thinking really

I also like the free agent defenseman both Jess and Oleo have advocated - Hainsey. Effective and cheap, can't ask for more. He may not give us the best of both worlds, but he's a right sight better than Roszival. While I may be the only one, I like Malik, but for some reason I feel rather sure he won't be returning to New York, lol. The problem with Malik is that we simply asked too much from the guy. He's a 4-5 defenseman, not a 1-2. I'd like to see Sauer some time next year if he recovers well from his injury - I've got a pretty good feeling about that guy.

Normally I disagree with you a lot Oleo, so it figures that I disagree with SOMETHING in your post at least... I don't agree that we don't have a possible elite player in our system. Cherepanov seems like the real deal, and we shouldn't forget that if he wasn't Russian he could have been a top five or ten pick. If he develops to the level he can, it is possible that he could be a real force in this league. If nothing else, he seems to be an effective finisher and he's got pretty good size. It doesn't hurt that he's playing in a good league as well, which I figure would help aid his development.

I get the feeling a lot of fans are going to be unhappy with our summer signings, or lack of, major summer signings. Like I said in another post, and Dubi stated in the article, next year may end up being a minor step backwards necessary for us to take two steps forward aka a bit of rebuilding. That, of course, is assuming Jagr doesn't return. If he does, we're still a second round playoff hockey team at the least and, depending on our luck with opponents in the playoffs, maybe even Stanley Cup finalists. We shouldn't be quick to forget that we did rather will in both our division, and the Eastern Conference this year. The only problem was the Pens getting the good Hossa brother... which I'm not TOO disappointed at since they at least put a dent in a good part of their future with that deal assuming they can't resign the guy.

On a completely unrelated note... well slightly related... I'm still astounded, but not surprised, that Malkin escaped slew-footing Mara twice with not even a slap on the wrist. Talk about a double standard. I respected Malkin before this series, as a player and for his talent, and sadly my respect has regressed to just his talent. There is no situation where such an act is acceptable (including the heat of the moment Therrien!) and there really was not much grounds for even that really. If you're a professional, you're going to have deal with losing. It's a fact of life. You may not like it, but it's no reason to go around slew-footing players after you lose ONE playoff game. Terrible stuff that...

[Malt Omeal]

Love the blog, thank you for all the great work this season. I sure hope that Jagr stays but I do believe the biggest hurdle for him will be agreeing to continue buying into Renney's system and doing it without most of his fellow Czechs. It would be great if the trio of Jagr, Rozi, and Stracena were all willing to take a pay cut (especially the latter two) but probably unlikely. I do think that NYR suffers without him and I do believe that a little fine tuning to his desires could keep him around (don't all superstars command a little special consideration?)

That said, I only see Renney's system working with Jagr if a) he grants him more ice time and PP time, b) gets an offensive minded power forward to compliment him and give him more space while presenting an alternative scoring threat on the same line, and c) that there is a side system created so that Jagr's line can play a more offensive minded game while the other lines bring the D-first strategy -- not sure this is even possible. Prucha needs to be reworked into the line up -- get that kid on the weights this offseason or something but if people were all bent about letting Jed go then I think we really lose with the loss of Prucha

[Matty *Happy Birthday to me*]

If you're a professional, you're going to have deal with losing. It's a fact of life. You may not like it, but it's no reason to go around slew-footing players after you lose ONE playoff game. Terrible stuff that...

Ryan,

Don't worry ... Malkin nor his team had to really deal with his classless act in our series but when he gets frustrated at the Flyers physical play and once again does something in the "heat of the moment" well that team will not only loudly complain right along with their fans and media but their coaches and gm as well ... the Flyers owner is one of Bettman's biggest supporters and friend so for those who believe in NHL Conspiracy, which I don't I just believe in NHL ineptitude, then this series will need to be won by the players in spite of the bad and missed calls that will surely bite them all in the rear ...

[jason]

3 years ago, we were suppose to go through a rebuilding process. This was what was wanted by the fans after 7 very long years of bringing in the best free agent and seeing player after player fail in New York. Their performance and our voices finally made Glen Sather decide that we needed to rebuild and no retool and do what we did for the previous 7 years.

Then a goalie drafted out in the 7th round 6 years before comes in and stands on his head and gives us all hope. A player we got for virutally nothing because Washington had enough of his head-case problems and unhappiness pretty much gives us the player and pays a chunk of his salary plays like he was capable of and sets single season goal and point records for an 80 year franchise.

We make the playoffs for the 3 straight seasons. The only of 1 of 3 teams in the eastern conference to do so. We had HUGE expectations this year set by ourselves, the press and our players only 3 years into a rebuilding process that we all wanted. We didn't get as far as we had all envisioned and now that we haven't we have seemed to abandoned the rebuilding process and are looking for quick fixes like Hossa, like Malone, like Redden, etc.

Have we not learned anything from our not so distant past? Do we not care anymore about it with a few good seasons?

[Malt Omeal]

one more final thought....I just hope Sathter doesn't do something stupid like insult Jagr with a low ball offer guaranteeing his departure and then tries to make up with it by overpaying for some has been or someone who had a huge season this year but will most likely disappear in a Blueshirt -- I really hope those days are gone, would rather endure a losing season with the roster right now than to see another parade of Lindros, Holiks, Carters, Bures, etc. and please do not go after Campbell - I really think that kid is way overrated -- he didn't do squat for the Sharks and I watched every game

[Mark W.]

I know Hossa would be a risky signing, but imagine Hossa-Dubinsky-Jagr, or if Jagr leaves, Hossa-Gomez-Dawes? Exciting line there, no?

[Matty *Happy Birthday to me*]

Great post Jason and I agre with you ...

Have we not learned anything from our not so distant past? Do we not care anymore about it with a few good seasons?

Some people see a season where you don't win the cup as a failure and it's fine for our players to feel that way because that's what they play for, the Cup ... but we as fans should take a long hard look at the team we have from the team we had just a few short years ago ... to the culture of players that we had that didn't give a damn about being a NY Ranger, about the team's history and tradition and certainly didn't give a damn about us, the fans ... some people get all hot and bothered over this star player or that star player and they want to be like kids at Candy Stores with a pocket full of money and just shop till they drop but that didn't work for us in the past ... 7 long years of futility, of players that I couldn't embrace even if I still cheered on the team ...

I never want that again ... I have faith in the people running the team and in whatever timetable they have ... that faith has been rewarded in the past 3 seasons not only by our team becoming stronger and making the playoffs all three seasons but by our management not trading away our future for quick fixes ... they could've done that but they didn't and that means that they are in it for the long term success of our team ... I'd rather be strong and be a contender year in and year out than be a one hit wonder ...

[Paul R _ _ _ _ _ D]

I agree with Matty and Jason, things weren't so Rosy when we went after all of the best players, on paper yeah we should have been a good team, it didn't work out that way I like what we have been doing for the lst couple years lets keep doing it.

[Paul R _ _ _ _ _ D]

I want the Rangers to win the cup a lot, however I would like it even more if they could do maybe twice in the same decade.

[CraigZ]

Bones... Mike Milbury?????Z

[Paul R _ _ _ _ _ D]

Craig I was thinking the same thing but I didn't want to type in fear of being laughed for over looking the obvious choice of whom ever he is talking about.

by the way matty Happy birthday.

[Paul R _ _ _ _ _ D]

Yeah I guess I did overlook an obvious choice, but I don't think Mess is ready to coach, not head coach but start as an assistant and work your way up, maybe he can replace Perry Pearn and have some kinds PP develop.

[Three Chord Monte]

For the Rangers next year, less could be more. If Jags stays away and Shanny retires, simply pin the C on Drury and move on. This team is stacked with enough offense to make the playoffs as long as a stronger blueline is secured/procured.

Tweaking can be done before the '08/'09 deadline. Perhaps Sather may do better than Wally Backman next year. J.D. got over on him big-time with that deal.

I like the coaches, but the PP must be addressed from the top down. Somebody must pay for that debacle so I guess Pearn is done. Hopefully he gets a nice shot elsewhere.

Younger is better. This team will be better without Jagr and Shanny. I wish them both well.

[oleosmirf]

first off the bure trade was one of the best trades the rangers ever made.

unfortunately after a tremendous start he had a career ending injury. Bure was one of the best players in the game and the Rangers got him. If Jagr goes the Rangers must get a player like Bure if they wish to compete...

[CraigZ]

It's going to be a long summer of do this and do that..Z

[Paul R _ _ _ _ _ D]

TCM, I'd rather keep Jagr around to give the young guys a leader to emulate.

[Paul R _ _ _ _ _ D]

Z, your right...

[oleosmirf]

matty

obviously they could make the playoffs but they would be far from stanley cup contenders no matter how much faith anyone has in them.

ryan

i know pretty much nothing about cherepanov besides the fact that he broke bure's rookie record but his numbers went down (although only slightly) in his sophomore year so thats not a great sign...

[Chris]

"Sean Avery spoke to Larry Brooks of the New York Post by phone and reported that he is nearly back to full health, was injured when he tried to hit Brooks Orpik early in Game 3, and wants to return to the Rangers next season"

made my day.
I would like JJ back.
Shannys too old now. Rosi does nothing for me. Prucha has done nothing. Straka passes too much.

[gravey]

I'm going to go on record as saying I prefer we don't sign Hossa. Someone needs to remind those of you drooling for him about his previous playoff record.

I know he's the one "big" offensive name out there this year and that he's doing OK in this year's playoffs, but this is the guy who has disappeared in every playoff series he's been in until this year. If playing with the Squid is what is helping him this year then it's pretty likely he'll revert to form should he be in the playoffs next year with the Rangers (and have no superstar to center him). Year after year, he has been invisible in important games.

I just don't see Hossa as a "money" player. When the going gets tough, he vanishes. (With the exception of this year. But that's only one year.) I'd rather spend the $$ on defense and a big tough forward. I'd rather have Malone for less money, for example.

[And This One Will Last A Lifetime]

I was going to say something in the same vein as oleosmirf.

I'll preface it by saying that I am not defending/condoning the Rangers team-building philosophy during the late 90's/early 00's nor am I suggesting they adopt a similar strategy now, but how many of the superstar players that we had on our roster in those years were honestly at the top of their game?

It's not like we had late 80's Fleury/LaFontaine, early 90's Bure and mid 90's Lindros. A number of those players were only available because they had suffered essentially career-ending/career-diminishing injuries or had other problems that prevented them from being elite players. Combine that with massively overpaying for mediocre talent: Skrudland/Keane, Valeri Kamensky, Lefebvre, Quintal, Holik, et al and yes, it's very easy to see why we were spring spectators not participants from 98-06.

I don't think we should/will get Marian Hossa but he is quite talented and is still in the prime of his career, plus he doesn't have the injury history of the aforementioned players. Given current market rates, Hossa will probably get around $6.5-$7 million. An old fashioned Ranger mistake would be giving someone of far lesser talent a similar contract.

[Chris QCT]

It is weird to actually read people blasting Glen Sather for NOT trading away the kids at the deadline now. In one breath, Shanny and Straka took precious playing time away from a young player. In the next, Sather should have traded those young players at the deadline in the first place. And then demanding Sather add Jagr, Avery, Hossa, and Campbell to the lineup and tie up almost 80% of the Cap in 7 players.

I think it is evident that this loss has tied us up in knots. I too have had a hard time getting my thoughts about this season straightened out. I personally think "post-lockout" Sather has done a pretty good job. This summer is going to be real interesting...

[Paul R _ _ _ _ _ D]

I would like to see just one stud defender, this way Marc has someone he can work with and become all that much better.

[Malt Omeal]

Gravey, exactly my point. We were chasing names (or more appropriately the legend of those names) and last year's stats instead of really analyzing whether these marquee names were available for a reason other than we were the only organization rich enough to throw dollars at them.

Barring some unfortunate events, some of these players could have delivered big time for us but that ignores what is seemingly obvious -- either the stage in NYC was too much or these players, for reasons I never understood (perhaps Kryptonite jerseys), just could not bring their A game consistently NYR. But that's the past, I just hope we stick with Jagr or we work from within. We don't need another big contract just to get another big name on the marquee. Like we won't give Jagr 6 but will overpay at 5 for someone with far less talent just to give the impression that we are going for the Cup this year. I just fear a huge contract extended to someone like Campbell and everyone getting psyched and then realizing we have no money left and he isn't that awesome anyway

I totally forgot about Skrudland, classic.

Just curious, has anyone ever compiled stats on the offensive production that former Rangers have against us after leaving the club?

[Jess]

Dubi

It is over then

However I think one of the areas that none of us really know when it comes to Jagr is Jagr himself.

He is a very private person and from what I have seen does not confide in any of those in the NYC media.

I talked to a couple of people who have coached or played with Jagr and even they do not know but both said something that MUST BE factored into trying to read whatever Jagr's intentions are.

The First is his pride, one has to believe that Jagr is a very proud person and what he just experienced with the Rangers hurt him inside. Whether it was the fans not really embracing him as they did Avery or the kids or Henrik also may have bothered him.

However there is one thing with his pride that does matter and that is his understanding of his place in hockey history. Jagr has a chance to play in his native Czech Republic as a member of the NHL and that will go a long way in whatever decision he makes.

Ask anyone who has seen how Jagr goes back in the off-season to help raise money and that alone is a huge calling card for the Rangers.

The Other factor is his privacy which I have been told Jagr guards like a bulldog. Remaining in NYC affords Jagr a lot more privacy than most other hockey towns. Other than perhaps LA there is no other city where Jagr could simply disappear into the shadows.

We also have a side to consider as well and that is Glen Sather, Sather is viewed as some kind of folk hero to those from the Eastern Europeans especially the Czechs. I have never understood why other than that Sather was actually in the Czech Republic when one of the uprisings took place.

The last thing Sather (IMO) wants to do is go over to Europe to play in the Czech Republic without Jagr. Right now many of the biggest hockey names (more at the NHL Offices) are scared to death that the Rangers will go over to Europe with either a rebuilding team or no Jagr.

Not to mention how nobody in the NHL wants the Rangers to lose the Victoria Cup especially to a Russian team given the current state of relations with the Russian Feds who are claiming they are just as good as the NHL

[Matty *Happy Birthday to me*]

Thank You PaulR. :)

BTW reading that Brooks article ... it seems that Avery is upset at the Daily News for the story they ran without checking out the facts ... at least that's how he came off ...

Jess,

So what are you trying to say? That the NHL will "help" or "facilitate" or "encourage" the Rangers to re-sign Jagr? I don't care, as long as he comes back to us I'll be a happy girl because unlike a lot of Rangers fans I am a big fan of him and I 100% appreciate what he has done for our organization since he became a Ranger

[Paul R _ _ _ _ _ D]

how exactly is the victoria cup gonna work? is it going to be the opening day line up and is it taking the place of the preseason?

[Tom]

Am i the only one that until he scored a goal forgot hossa was even on the pens??? Unless he' one of those players he seemed invisible every game and thne end up scoring. Malkin on the other hand I noticed him every time he stepped on the ice not just when he scored. IMO Hossa is a complemetary player. He is not something to have as your center piece. Also, Why is everyone sayign a flyers type of makeover, did we end up i nthe basement and i not realize it?? Come on people we got to the final 8, your making it out like we missed the playoffs. I much rather see what I would call a MTL makeover. That team did not make the playoffs last year and lost Souray who at that time was a BEAST on the power play. BUT they did not panic and go out and throw money everywhere, they stuck with the peices they had and used UFA to fill in the holes but didnt go out and get the best avalible players they got the right ones. (see Hamrlik (sp?)) This team went from no playoffs to first in the east with out going out and landing that big fish at a position. They allowed their home grown talent to have the bigger roles (Higgins and those russian brothers i forget their names) and were patient with the pieces they had (Kovalev). This worked worked for them as I'm sure it would work for use i'm sure and we arent talkign about going from no playoffs to #1 we are right up there to start. We need to be patient with this team! while also bringing in some guys that can fill roles. Not necessarly the top guys avaliable. I'm refering to maybe getting Orpik for example for our blueline or maybe a Ryder to fill a spot on the wing (if the coacing staff feels hes the RIGHT player not the BEST player). Call me crazy but i feel little deals like that would be much more benificial to our team then spending all our crash on hossa's and campbell's. I do not see the need for major change on this team, i think we need tweaks, adjustments, and most of all PATENTICE with the product before us. I mean look at the pens too. Before they landed hossa they had basically the same they did last year and they lost in 5 games in the first round and then this year finished the year at #2. Be patient folks and hope we make some little deals to get the RIGHT players not the necessarly the best ones.

P.S. I feel we lost to the best team in the east so question if we played another team this round, won then had the pens in the conference finals and it turned out this exact same way would everyone still be as upset?

[jason]

No Tom, it was only you. He had 4 goals and an assist. Pretty good in my book.

[wwwc9]

Regarding next year, my preference for next year is to let the kiddies play, let them go thru their growing pains, and draft high and well (no more hughs, and to think Carter went 1 pick before. So close.)

If sather decides to go for the cup, do we really think we have the talent for it? Every1 will be a year older and if u sign hossa, he hasn't been monster in the playoffs so he's no guarentee to push us over the top. Also, every year, we barely squeak into the playoffs.

Right now, we seem to have players at the tail ends and at the beginning of their careers with the exception of Drury and gomez. And gomer and dru aren't the elite players in the league imho even though sather is paying them like they are (same goes for Rosy).

I think this is as far as they can go. And think of the patterns of the last few yrs. We make the playoffs at the very end (thk goodness for the shootout. What would the record be without it), win a round and then get bounced. Anyone think we could take the ducks last year or dallas/ detroit this year if we made it that far.

I think this is our post lockout pattern. I'd prefer a solid core (and please draft the right talent) so that when dubi, cally, staal,etc. peak, we've got a real chance at the cup.

Imho, wouldn't a year of development with the prospect of a future team of alexei, arteem, and others with taveres be worth it?

Didn't the yankees go through some lean years to get talent?

The knicks can stink for a year and still sell out so nyr can do it.

However, I understand that its not a good business stance and sather and dolan would never do it.

[Malt Omeal]

Jagr brought this organization and its fans out of a dark abyss, clearly not a 54 year type abyss but no doubt dark times. Arguably, he willed this team back into the playoffs and respectability by being an absolute horse and carrying a team with a loss less offense than the current roster on his back for much of the way. He does not seek the spotlight which makes many see him as indifferent - either way, I think the discussion should be moot after his on ice playoff performance -- that is exactly the type of driven, blue collar effort this team lacked for so many years before he came to town. Get him back and make the adjustments.

That aside, I wholeheartedly agree with Tom's post -- the little character pickups will aid us much more than the marquee pickups -- Campbell? still don't understand why he seems so coveted by Ranger fans -- I'm on the west coast so I saw most of the Sharks games, no question he isn't super talented but he is definitely not the end all solution to our PP or lack of offensive D-man power -- I may have missed something but besides his breakout goal i didn't see him do squat. I just feel like he is exactly the type of guy who everyone thinks will work miracles and then in a Blueshirt he will mysteriously fall off the radar. We do have a good supporting cast but we still need another difference maker, someone who can punish people in front of Hank and someone who can help lead a formidable forecheck or crush someone out of the way so Jagr can do his thing. I just hope Sather et al don't panic this summer the way a lot of us fans seem to be panicking and suggesting this team needs a major overhaul in any sense.

[Matty *Happy Birthday to me*]

Sam Weinman updated his blog and Jagr said that the Rangers are his first option but Sam also said that Jagr is intrigued about finding out what his worth is in the open market(he's never been a free agent before) but he dislikes change ...

“First I am going to talk to the Rangers,” Jagr said. “That’s No. 1 option for me. I don’t like to change. I feel very comfortable here, with all the people around this organization who are nice to me. They give me a chance to show everybody I still can play hockey. Everybody doubt me when I was playing in Washington for whatever reason. The Rangers gave me a chance and believed in me. All the trainers, everybody around, are so nice to me and so good to me. All I have to do is concentrate on hockey.”

* He reports that Shanny is leaning to playing at least one more year and that the knee injury that he suffered in January bothered him the rest of the way ...

* Straks says that he isn't done playing hockey but doesn't know where he will play and that Jagr's decision will greatly impact his own ...

* Dubinsky, Toots and Henrik will all play in the Worlds for their respective countries ... Henrik not until Thursday because his knee is/was sore from a hit in game 4(I love him more) and Aves will start his Vogue internship on Monday .... Avery(on an OnDemand Video from Rangers.Com) called the Daily News "The National Inquirer" as he took a dig at the newspaper due to how they first reported what happened to him ...

all very interesting things ...

[mhurley]

Wait a minute here! Dubi, are you blaming Jagr's failure to make the 13 points to trigger his contract extension on Renney's defensive system? If you are, I can't believe we watched the same player for 3/4 of the season.

IMO the only reason Jagr failed to make the necessary points was because HE didn't want to. Why wouldn't he want to make his triggers? Hmmmm, maybe he wanted to see what he was worth in Omsk or the open market rather then be committed to the New York Rangers for another season.

How many times did we watch Jagr overhandle and overpass the puck on the powerplay? How many times did we watch Jagr saunter off the ice and not be defensively responsible with the puck? How many times did we see Jagr forecheck, backcheck and be fully engaged in the game earlier in the season?

I cannot and will not buy Jagr not making his trigger because of the perceived lack of talent of his teammates. What I saw was one stubborn individual player unwilling to adjust his style one iota. What I saw was constant, unnecessary line churning to find soemone who might click with Jagr.

I don't know about anyone else but I would be more then willing to go with our currently signed players and a mix of youth and NOT make the post season next year, then see anymore pandering to any individual or group of certain players. There is no I in team.

Dubi, I say the above with all due respect. I value your opinions and appreciate all the hard work you guys do here at BB.

Just for the record I would not overpay for Avery under any circumstance. He's lucky to have been a Ranger and I think he knows that. Shanahan MUST retire for the sake of his legacy. He's finished. He didn't bring a Cup to NYR. He better know that Ranger fans will not cut him the slack that was cut the aging Messier. Cut loose Mara, Malik and Rozsival. They don't hit, they don't shoot and they don't clear the crease. I'd rather see Baranka, Hutchenson and Sanguinetti.

[Bones]

Marek Malik!!!!????? He can start coaching in the Czeck Republic first, where we could trade him for a bag of pucks. There is absolutely no doubt in my mind that Messier would evolve into a fantastic coach. He basically coached the team when Clueless Campbell was in charge. Who can forget when he called that timeout against Calgary, that led to a total shift in momentum in that game. He just took over and righted the ship--that wasn't coaching? Don't get me started on Trottier. I got major flak for saying he was dumber than a sack of hammers and would be a miserable failure. Too bad THE GENIUS thought he was hiring an author!

[rangerbill94]

adam

"Rangerbill, how is Rosival an asset?" Well, Adam, he's not if you allow you emotions to rule. I prefer some facts. Yes, he does turn the puck over, name me a defenseman that doesn't? Yes, he takes penalties, about 1 every other game. Big deal. Now ponder this:

Among Rangers this season:
7th in scoring, the highest scoring D'man on the roster
6th in goals scored
4th in PP goals
6th in scoring %

Among NHL defensemen this season:
21st overall in scoring (next best Ranger D'man-Girardi @48th)
19th (tied) in PP goals, ahead of Schnieder, Lidstrom, Blake and Campbell!

Please tell me the player that will fill that void? Pock? Baranka? Sags? Potter?

We have 4 good D'men. None of them are 1st pair guys; Tyutin, Girardi, Staal and Rozsival. We have 4 that compete for the 3rd pairing in Mara, Malik, Backman, Strudwick. Only Strudwick can truly be considered a 7th D'man, simply because the other 3 make about $3,000,000/yr!

If we keep Rozi, then we may need only 1 top D'man and that guy should be a "hitter". The 6th D'man could be Pock, Baranka or one of the leftover high priced guy, probably Mara, based on his playoff performance.

I can easily see a "hitter" paired with Rozi (remember, Rozsival had the highest TOI stats among all Rangers), Tyutin/Girardi and Staal/Mara (Pock). If Pock makes it out of the offseason as a Ranger and he makes the cut he may get paired with Girardi. Only time will tell and Sather's decision regarding another D'man.

That's why Rozsival is an asset.

[akayama49]

I've listened to everyone else express their opinions regarding the team and now it's my turn for observations:

I. I rate this season as B+ for result, but A- for entertainment value. (My 46th as a Rangers fan)

II. A significant part of the problems the team faced had to do with less than optimum deployment of the players we had available, not injuries or a lack of talent.
Those bloggers who complain about the stubborness of the Ranger
coaching staff to use existing roster players properly on the power play (Adam, in particular)are absolutely correct. The coaches persisted in sending out the same, tired group, when they had younger, better options, who would have taken advantage of the extra space the 5-4 situation would have given them.

III. The emergence of Nigel Dawes seemed to come as surprise to alot of people. He is one special player when it comes to the offensive side of the game, what with great passing vision and shooting ability. What surprised most was that Dawes led the team in plus-minus with a +11 this season, this from a player who was smeared with the label (even by his coaches) as somehow deficient in the defensive zone. I watched every minute he played and the numbers prove the ludicrousness of that assertion. his backchecking was first-rate as well.

IV. Ryan Callahan, despite his long goal-scoring drought, posseses the heart of a lion, and I look forward to his continued improvement next year.

V. The area where we need most improvement is defense. Too many mental errors throughout the year by our so-called top defensemen. Better play by our D would have helped move the puck down the ice in a more timely fashion, leading to better offensive results.

VI. Lundqvist's top game is excellent; he must develop more consistency if he is to lift the Cup someday. I recall top Ranger goalies who took several years to win their first playoff series (Giacomin, Richter)despite success in the regular season.
Henrik must dig deeper to reach the next level.

[Phill]

So Jagr purposely tanked the season because he wants to test the market?

Wow . . . I really don't even know what to say about that accusation.

[rangerbill94]

bones, the Malik comment was a joke. Just a play on MM, that's all!

However, I'm not a Messier fan. It's one thing to call a timeout and then right the ship when you're all laced up. It's quite a different thing when you're wearing a suit! Someday he may be a coach, but I don't want him getting on the job training at the expense of the NY Rangers. I'll leave that up to Gretzky and the Coyotes. What a change since the Great One showed up, eh?

[i]

mhurley there's ME in team, and that's who Sather basically answers to , himself. His job is to get to the 2nd rd of the playoffs. He's done it 2 years in a row, plus a first rd exit. Why do you think he didn't make a major move at the deadline? Why didn't he trade Malik for something? It's fairly obvious that he knows buttman doesn't really want the NYR to go far, he wants his small market teams there. So his refs slant & turn blind eyes. The NYR are suppose to be in a competitive rebuild as a work in progress. They really didn't progress this season. They signed 2 top centers, and forgot about a D man. They waived Kaspar, Hutchinson, & Pock to keep what they had which was not good enough defensively, offensively, nor gritty. Their PP has been weak for 2 seasons with no real improvement. Renney can coach, just look what he did in game 3 & 5 getting them to come back & tie. But he didn't get the job done because he's too nice, just the way Sather wants him to be. Sorry to wet your corn flakes, but as long as buttman is the commissioner, and Sather the GM, what you've seen the last 3 seasons is as good as it will get. Too bad the NYR won't tank. They know many of their' corp fans' won't show or re-up if they do.I'm with Bones, bring in MM, BL, MR, & AG. They are NYR!

[rangerbill94]

akayama49

I agree with most of your post, but I will take exception to the "stubborness of the Ranger coaching staff to use existing roster players properly on the power play (Adam, in particular)are absolutely correct. The coaches persisted in sending out the same, tired group, when they had younger, better options, who would have taken advantage of the extra space the 5-4 situation would have given them." The problem with your argument is we played so many games that were very low scoring and tight games that putting rookies and 2nd year players out there could have cost us wins. Yes, what you say in hindsight is very true. At a time when the score is tied or we are down by a goal, every coach, with a team in playoff contention, would always go with the experienced players. If a critiscm can be made, it would be not using Prucha on the PP, but his failure to perform was his own downfall. I'm also not sure your Dawes commenmt is on the mark. His first 2 stints this year with the big club were not 2-way play masterpieces. Further, his trips back to Hartford were more a "numbers game" than anything else. When he came back for good, his 2-way play was very good. He is a pure sniper and should be a real effective forward for a long time to come. He is a keeper, for sure.

Maragaret, he would have made $9 million had he hit his trigger -- no way he makes that next year, not even in Omsk. Missing the trigger will cost him at least $1.5 mil, maybe $2 - 2.5 -- no way he missed it on purpose.

He said all season long that he was OK playing Renney's system, just don't expect him to put up the same kind of numbers. But even so, he thought he'd hit 84 no sweat.

I didn't ignore his own role in missing those numbers, but I was more trying to examine his state of mind, not the fans' state of